Homemade solar panels/wind turbines

Let me start by saying I'm new here and hope I don't come across as a total ignoramus (which of course, I am when it comes to this subject, lol!).

 

I am curious about these ads across the internet that say you can buy their tutorial and that you can offset the cost of brand new solar panels by making your own. These tutorials also include wind turbines. Does anyone know anything about this/experienced it?

 

We would like to be completely off the grid using solar panels and wind, if we can afford it.

 

I would love to hear feedback about this. Thanks! :-)

Hm...I'm not a solar panel or wind turbine expert myself, but I would imagine that depending on your application, making your own panels or turbines might be difficult if you're looking to get your entire home off grid.

 

Take this article from Gristmill on DIY wind and solar systems...for $300 and with 3 days, you could build a 50 kilowatt-hours per month turbine for 10% of your electricity usage or for $150, you could make a solar charger for your electronics.  You might also be interested in this thread about Green Power Science's project of building a solar panel from a satellite dish.

Forget those rip-off adverts for tutorial leaflets!  See this instructable on how to build a solar panel in step by step pictures for free.

 

www.instructables.com/id/Build_a_60_Watt_Solar_Panel/

 

Sure you can make your own panels but it's a fiddly and risky business (you'll break a few cells while doing it) and the end result is unlikely to last 30 years but if you're good at woodwork and soldering, go for it.

 

One local manufacturer I talked to is doing just this.  They buy in the cells and make the frames themselves.  Only reason I didn't buy from them was that they couldn't guarantee the panels (they only maken the frame and the cell manufacturer won't want to know you if you phone them).

 

 

I agree the turorials are a rip off - both solar PV and wind.

 

The wind power DIY and residential units I have done more research on. Most if not all residential wind turbines call for a 28 mph wind to achieve their rated capacity. 28 mph wind is storm conditions and according to NCDC no where in the US gets that kind of average wind. Commercial units are realistic on their generation capabilities.

 

  The power generated goes down drastically with less wind speed.

"The first key concept that this formula shows is that when the wind speed doubles, the power available increases by a factor of 8. That means there’s very little power available in low winds."http://www.otherpower.com/windbasics1.html

 

The commercial wind farms use tall towers to get up into better & more stable winds.

 

 

I looked up the cost/savings for the area where I grew up in Oregon. Good deal!

 

After rebates & incentives the system for 50% of my requirement would cost 50,000 USD with a 22 year payback - hard to beat that!

 

For 100% supply it more than doubled (260%) to 135,000 USD with a 25.5 year payback.

 

Better to invest in a commercial wind farm or something that works. 

Making solar panels is not a easy task. There are many people that think if I build a solar panel that is all I need to do. First let me tell you that if you build more than one they must be the same voltage and AMPs. If they are not exactly like each other the lower power output would be you basic output. Never mix different solar panels into one group. It will work but your power will be reduced to the low wattage solar panel. I do not recommend that you try this in anyway. You could hurt yourself or get shocked. The get rich plans on building your own solar panels is for the publisher of the instructions, or book. You will see if you try this yourself. Would you build a car? No not when you can buy a car! Why build solar panels when you can buy them already done. Think about it!  

 Very correct jim386! For a science experiment it is possibly a great idea. For production of power it is a very bad idea.

Some sites selling DIY instructions for solar panels.windmills for 49.99 (reduced from 199.99) USD are saying that follow their instructions and they suggest that for 200 USD you can have your own solar setup. 

The following URL tells the whole story in a very funny manner! http://www.diysolar.com/ this is the truth of the matter!

Also on a semi related note if you're building your own green energy gear, and you end up wanting to sell your home gear and all, you may have a harder time selling. In New Mexico, we built a passive solar house, and wanted to add a bunch of green features (really basic stuff too - I'm talking composting toilets) and our Realtor flipped. He showed us some stats about green features that are more kooky (to the general public, not greenies) and they are a harder sell. Which one, is not a reason NOT to use greener building methods, but it is something to consider if you may sell. Real gear vs. homemade may be an easier selling point.

That said I agree with the above. Building your own is a fun experiment, but not as smart for everyday as buying reliable power methods from an actual maker.

whirnot's air collector shown in the renewable forum is a great example of what can be done - though from the appearance he is a very good handyman in the shop.

With heating air the concentration effect is not dangerous like with the Fresnel lens or PV panels. 
 

The great green Google has no problem accepting advertising from companies making outlandish claims.

One of the ads along side the page is for DIY solar. What this ad represents is really a sick joke of someone trying to take advantage of people with too little knowledge in a particular field.

1. Ads by Google  - http://www.greendiyenergy.com/indexcd3.php

2. For a reality check I will again post this link for a bit of a laugh   http://www.diysolar.com/ 

Roughly How much is all this going to cost for say a four bedroom house?

Hi spaloverbill - welcome to the Eco Huddle!

Cost depends on your kWh consumption. That varies widely depending on personal habits.

Geographic location, house orientation and shading all play an important factor in the potential output of panels. You would require less panels in the Mojave Desert than in Seattle for example. Elevation is also considered though it is a minor element. A 200 watt panel puts out 200 watts under specified laboratory conditions - not your home conditions. 

A Southwest USA location may receive an annual average of 5.5 hours of productive sunlight per day.

Panels - the cheapest they have ever been - are now in, roughly, the 3 to 4 USD per watt range then comes the inverter, installation and what all. Grid tie is generally preferred (though not by all) as it eliminates the battery storage. It also works best in places that have net metering or a FIT (feed in tariff). PV panels are far more attractive in LA than central Oregon due to the cost per kWh of power.

The first place to start is to reduce the load as much as possible. Energy efficient lamps and appliances can help minimize the system size required and consequently system cost. Energy efficiency is far, far cheaper than PV power.

Do you use electricity for heating? Is a well pump involved?

The first step in utilizing solar power should probably be thermal panels for water heating. Water heating is something like 4 times more efficient than power production.  

 

Hey Guys,

I'm a consultant for Turbina wind and we've developed a wind turbine that can generate full capacity of 300 W or 5000 KW at wind speeds of 1.5 m/s.  I know it sounds crazy, but if you google Turbina + Platts you'll see that we're in contention for the Sustainable Technology Innovation of the Year. 

Russ, could you contact me?  I can't send private messages yet and I'd like to get your opinion on what you think about our technology.

Best regards,

Dave

Hey Russ,

I over shot my estimates.  You were right.  Unfortunately, I'm the marketing guy and not the engineer.  I spoke with the engineers to get a fact check and 1.5 m/s is the cut-in wind speed.  I'm in the process of putting together a website that explains just how the technology works.  I'll update you when it's done and the engineers have fact checked everything.

I'd really like your opinion.  In the last couple days since I've been studying the basics of wind energy, it looks like there is a lot of bad info out there.  I thought I was a smart guy with a BS in Biochemistry and Cell Biology but this stuff gives me headaches.  Wind variability, direction, energy density curves.  The economics of wind energy makes me feel like a 4th grader again.

Much kudos to everyone at ecohuddle that is helping to get proper information to the public.

Best regards,

Dave

P.S.  I'm really sorry for posting false info.  I'll do much more due dilligence in future posts.

Hi Dave, Thanks for the follow up on your original post. All of us are learning and hopefully all of us do better tomorrow than today.

Wind is very interesting and there is far more garbage information floating around than good. Many people get excited about the latest idea with no idea whether it is practical, has a basis in engineering or is just a scam cooked up during wild chatter.

I try to make myself and life style more green over time but I really get irritated with the 'kill the people to save the whales' bunch you find on so many green sites. I also get irritated with many of the green blogs that are no more than someone with a PC who likes to chatter.

I would be happy to be of assistance in any way I am able.

Best Regards,
Russ 

This is one of the hardest answers that I know how to answer. First look at your yearly electric bill. Pick on the month that uses the most electric power. Now that you have that bill in your hand. Just look at the total amount of KW used for that expensive month. There are 720 hours a month. Take your KW usage and divide this by 720 and you will have your answer. Electric power is based on usage and not how many feet the home is our even how many bedrooms. Now if you are going to build a home. I recommend that you consider a solar thermal hot water heating system, geothermal heating and cooling system. White roof and solar panels installed on a two axis solar stand. That will make the home sustainable and off grid.

Hi  jim386, Virtually no one wants to buy solar panels which are still horribly expensive to support the typical home electrical load.

Step 1 is energy conservation to try to reduce to overall requirement.

If someone put solar thermal panels on the roof to try to support a hydronic hot water heating system the roof would be covered with those panels alone. I was interested in this scheme until I looked at it closely. No hope!

Geothermal heating and cooling is better - how good depends on your location and the underground temperature. That temperature varies widely over the country with Southern areas typically being warmer but you have to look at data for your particular area. The heat exchange area, either pipe loops in wells or buried is an extra cost. For me the cost of 3 wells for heat exchange was prohibitive. The payback was off in never-never land. The more efficient inverter style heat pumps are nearly as efficient as geothermal ground source heat pumps.

For an individual home, good roof insulation is most important. The white color really only reflects some of the light to lower the overall area temperature gain.

An off grid solar system has to have batteries and is far less efficient than a grid connected solution making an already expensive system even more expensive. If frequent power failures are not a problem and the grid is available it is by far the best 'battery'.

For a new home design passive solar is important as well as:
1) home orientation - direction the home faces
2) thermal mass
3) use natural draft for cooling - depending on the area
4) correct windows for the location and select locations with heat gain/loss in mind
5) overall insulation - type and thickness